[locked]15 year old drops out and whaps Malaysia

Avvieey · Potential Super Best Friend Joined: Dec 15, 2005 Posts: 3

Attn: TOPDOG!!!

Just for your reference (and to defend myself), I don't oppose people migrating or whatever they want to do (as long as nobody gets hurt)! Also, just to further clarify myself, I have no problem with constructive criticism. And, I also support freedom of speech. Last but not least, I love Malaysia.

Here is my point of view:

nick_khaw · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:17 pm Post subject:

Pragmatism would dictate making an easier choice from a tougher choice. Pragmatism dictated getting out of it into what he obviously thinks would be an easier choice. If he thinks it's tougher, of course he's not going to choose that option. For someone who can reason as well as you can, I'm surprised you can't come up with that conclusion.

Dude, I cannot act logically for 100% of my life and I certainly do not have 100% control over my sub-conscious thoughts and I may not have 100% control over all my actions. But, you don't get it do you? All I'm saying is, yes, there is a tinge of arrogance in me but I also think he is weak. I don't see what that has to do with being 100% bla bla bla. Again, for someone who can reason as well as you can, I'm surprised you can't get that.

Every good book has good sources. Surely, you can reason that as well. Even something like Rousseau's Social Contract had freaking sources.

Lol. I don't like brushing this off as talking cock either. But our dear MaxForce seems to be brushing this off as talking cock. So I choose to follow his/her train of thought. If he/she decides this is not talking cock, then I'll choose to follow that train of thought as well. And well, if he/she thinks that I don't get what he/she is trying to say, perhaps he/she can make things clearer by what he/she means by talking cock. Cos the way I understand it now, all this talk is talk cock and is pretty much worthless.

Actually, it is kind of worthless. But there are times when I can't help but do worthless things. And this happens to be one of those things.

Salvation · Friend Joined: Mar 11, 2005 Posts: 397 Location: Bordeaux

DecentMerson · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:31 pm Post subject:

topdog · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:43 pm Post subject:

paradox_equation · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:59 pm Post subject:

hey, i have puny brain. no idea why everyone seems intent on bashing him for dropping out of school or trying to publish a book or complaining about the system.

who cares about what's he doing with his life? why judge whether leaving the system is suitable for him or not? how would YOU know?

yeah, well. he ain't gonna change the world now. he might not in the future. but the fact is that he is 15, and he has some strong views on issues. as i've said before, i'll take someone who cares about issues rather than someone who plays dota (no offense, i play it too!) anyday.

i think it's absolutely worthless to bash him (as in, his character, his passions, his personality, his choices) on recom. you want to criticize his actions on College confidential? you disagree with his radical views on malaysian issues? sure, but let him defend his ideas and his actions. everyone gets a fair trial, no?

unfortunately, he hasn't appeared for a sensible dialogue yet.

(non-offensive tone) tell me, naoj, what was the point of this whole thread in the first place? it's rather amusing, actually. we have spent quite some time and energy debating about a 15 year old kid whose views are surely reflective of his age. we only dissect eminent personalities, no? mahathir would be worthy of serious discussion. or anwar. or bush. but johnleemk......who?

so if you seriously want to dispute his ideas or his views...no point posting here until he (if ever) appears for a dialogue. if you want to pick and bicker about a 15 year old kid, then yeah, by all means, continue doing so. it's your choice, anyway.

nick_khaw · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:04 pm Post subject:

My dear paradoxequation, that was the most contradictory post I have ever read. Quite a paradox, pun intended.

If you think it's worthless, then why did you post? Let us "worthless" ones continue with our "worthless" endeavors.

And we don't always have to "dissect emminent personalities". I'll dissect any sort of personality.

And, er, yeah, he defends his ideas and his actions on collegeconfidential as well as in his book. We're not preventing him from speaking now, are we? I don't understand why you brought that up in the first place.

Your previous post is as your name suggests. A paradox. Pun intended.

paradox_equation · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:19 pm Post subject:

no, what i meant was to get him HERE, in recom, to talk about things. as of now, it's a rather one-sided thread.

i said it was worthless to bash him (his character, his choices, his personality), not his ideas. my intention was to steer this thread back to what i think would be most productive. character assassination brings one nowhere. i'm sorry if i didn't make that clear enough.

oneforthelord · Friend Joined: Nov 07, 2005 Posts: 97 Location: Singapore

nick_khaw · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:28 pm Post subject:

Okay, and what is most productive for this thread? I believe the title suggests that we discuss this kid.

If you mean me, I'm not assassinating your character. I merely said your post was a paradox, just like your name. How you relate it to character baffles me. But saying your post is a paradox might lead you to be less contradictory in your writing. So, it might bring us somewhere.

Well, maybe by "bashing" (and I think that bashing would be too harsh a word here, I prefer criticizing) his character, personality whatever here, he might take out the positives of this constructive criticism.

So, er, to please paradox_equation, Johnleemk! If you're reading this, I do admire you in one way and have less admiration for you in another way. You know what I'm talking about and I see no need to repeat myself. However, if you choose to accept this constructive criticism, it might be good for you. So, yeah, all of us here want the best for you; I know I do.

There, paradox_equation. I believe that should clear things up.

Apparently, he is in recom. He chooses not to respond, that's all. Can't really fault anyone us for that, surely.

nick_khaw · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:39 pm Post subject:

Ahhh, oneforthelord. I have no idea why you're getting heated. I am certainly not heated, in any way. Though, in this frigid weather here, I do need some heat, but that's another matter altogether.

Oh yeah, I know about the arduous process of writing a book. But, all I'm saying is, he NEEDS SOURCES. Every good book needs a source. Sure, what he writes could be articulated better, but that improves with drafts. But at the very core of it, he needs sources! Sources legitimates his claims.

Well, fine, according to definition, you're definitely right. But let's go back to the original topic then. So, based on that definition, you can't say that he made the harder choice now, can you? You said this :-

So for all those who lambast him for taking the easy way out, think again. The path he is taking is the harder path not the easier one. The easiest one is to go through it, memorize what you need to memorize and go to tuition centres and learn the tips to get A's.

Well, clearly, you can't decide what is harder and what is easier. Who's to say what is easier and what is harder? Seriously, if you can still say your point about his path being the harder path holds true given the definition you have just showed, your post would be just like our dear friend's paradox_equation's posts, paradoxes. I think, a more fair statement would be that we all choose what is most practical to us. And I don't fault him for doing what's practical to him. I just think that he gives up too easily. And that is not a good trait.

Well, according to your reasoning of being detached from emotions and thoughts and actions bla bla bla, then no one can make a logical decision right? So, given my weaknesses, I'm making the most logical reason possible from my, er, lack of detachment. I think that would be a fair statement.

lyzzy · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:42 pm Post subject:

Well, wouldn't his choices in life reflect his ideas as well? As in, his choice not to take the SPM would probably reflect some idea of his that the SPM is worthless and etc etc etc?

So, I think that criticizing/ discussing his choices is fair game...

Anyway, he previously mentioned that he wasn't able to sign up on Recom...

(I have a final in 10 hours time!! Sad

)

oneforthelord · Friend Joined: Nov 07, 2005 Posts: 97 Location: Singapore

youngyew · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:24 pm Post subject:

Moderator note: I would say that some of the arguments here are getting personal, as evidenced by lines like "you can't think clearly", "I am surprised that you can't get it" etc. In any argument, please refer to the ideas and opinions but not the persons. If personal attacks persist, this thread will be closed.

I would suggest everyone to reread the thread, and ask yourselves, "why are we saying all these?" Put yourselves in John's shoes, if you visit the Worldwide Malaysian Students Network and find that people there are bashing you like a pariah, what would you feel? Please remind yourself that you are discussing a 15-year-old adolescent in a public forum, so refrain from attacking him personally. In case anyone has forgotten, please reread Recom's Policy on Personal Attacks. If John has indeed visited the forum but refused to reply, I can empathize his feeling and understand his reasons.

So ladies and gentlemen, you can be critical of John's thoughts and opinions; but don't make any allegation (weak, condescending etc) regarding his personality. In any case, be kind to our 15-year-old brother.

Maxforce · Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:41 pm Post subject:

Before this thread gets closed, allow me to have my say...
nick khaw... your comments does not warrant a reply. Constructive criticism? You've got a long way to go.

Now is Malaysia better or worse? Well I think the context is irrelevant. Main thing here is are we in denial? Are we embarrassed when someone mentioned something so true? Are we angry because of that? Will we not face the truth and start changing? Now before change can begin, we must first accept that a change is necessary. Hence, I see that this 15 year old kid has done nothing wrong except that he dared to speak the truth despite knowing he will be "executed" by all Malaysians, or almost all. Therefore his courage is commendable. And his speech is not considered talking cock for all the drastic measures he had taken. Therefore, in my opinion earned his credibility. As for myself, nickkhaw, I am making changes everyday in my circle of influence, which extends only to my working environment. You will not see a non productive, non progressive working environment. Simply said, a world class standard working environment. Of course, you would need to consider the definition and what are the differences.

The reasonable man adapts to the world
The unreasonable man adapts the world to himself
Therefore ALL progress depends on the unreasonable man
And our 15 yr old brother is one unreasonable man
I believe that one day he will be able to lead us to more progressive era, if he chooses to.