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Maxforce
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Joined: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 241
Location: Klang, Selangor
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 Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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A piece of constructive criticism
Attitude almost always determine the altitude.
Too opinionated, too arrogant at such a tender age will get you nowhere. No one will be willing to transfer their knowledge to you. Fact is, people will even avoid you. Even if you're the next Einstein, you will NOT be recognised if you have NO people skill and NO respect for elders whom has seen and taste life much longer than your existence. |
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bush
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Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 1361
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | As kimsiang has mentioned, those who are prodigies and all sometimes end up being arrogant and condescending. Well, I put forth the motion that those who have successfully "gone through the system and survived" can end up the same way. In other words, it's the "Hah! I've been through it and survived but you ran away! I'm therefore better than you because you coudln't swim and had to flee instead of going through it like I did!" syndrome (or variations of it). For those who belittle him as a quitter who couldn't cope with the system, I'd like to pose a question to you: Is it easier to do self-study on O levels with no help from school teachers or friends or is it easier to take SPM with help from teachers in school? John is taking O levels as a private candidate! Which means no teachers or friends in school to ask if he doesn't understand something. That shows a lot of independence. Granted, you can argue that he can always look for tuition, but then again, remember that in Malaysia there are few tuition centres teaching O levels as compared to the thousands for SPM.
That's exactly what he's trying to do to encourage change. He hasn't done anything because he's still in the first stages of writing a book. I'm sure you've written essays and the like before. Obviously what he's written is very unfinished and if you've communicated with him about it before you'd know that he is working on deepening and expanding the book to make it less "ranty". Oh yes you can criticize him and all, but you should give him a year or more to develop his book more before brushing it off as just an angry ranting book.
I'd like to offer up a theory as to why this is so: It's a legacy of the British-based education system. It happens as well in Singapore, but the Singapore Government is trying to insert critical thinking here and there. I don't know if it's changed back in Britain (maybe it has, maybe it hasn't) but you do realise that the format of the Malaysian system and most of the Singaporean system is "one question, one correct answer". Try something different and you get no marks.
Anyway, if I'm not mistaken he's in ReCom already (or that's what he said in his email reply). I may have lost my train of thought somewhere along the post because there's a lot of text here, sorry yeah if it's disjointed  |
Actually, you can easily get tutors for O-levels in the klang valley.
Secondly, I remember that the science subjects which i took for SPM doesn't go by that 'one question,one answer' scheme. It's pretty much open-ended when it comes to the essay. |
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ayjk
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Joined: Jul 10, 2005
Posts: 13
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:28 pm Post subject: Newbie |
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I'm new to this thread, but reading all 5 pages of posts and johnlee's posts, I urge a sense of reason and a good look at the issue at hand.
At 15, I would probably say that I was a little something of a John Lee myself. I was incessantly idealistic, and bashing policies, though in my own mind, not publicly. At 15, it seemed that one's energy could change the world, though sadly that is not the case. I have just turned 19, and my viewpoint is very much more jaded now. Pragmatism is the keyword here.
I survived the Malaysian education system, as did many of my schoolmates. I'm doing A-Levels now, run directly from England (which is one of the 'shining paragons' of education in this day). I am still doing well, it's because I learnt to work with the system that exists. John is not wrong in saying that our Malaysian system has its flaws, but if I can suceed in the British system, surely it's not too bad, is it? Many of my friends from Malaysian government-run schools have also done well in the American system, securing places in top-notch universities in the USA.
If you can't beat the system, learn to manipulate it! |
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nick_khaw
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Joined: Mar 17, 2005
Posts: 107
Location: Cambridge, Massachusetts
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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Oneforthelord, oh yes, I agree with you that sometimes our actions are influenced by our thoughts and emotions without our knowledge. And well, our condemnation of his actions could very well be to that. I admit, part of my condemnation is. It's just that part of my condemnation isn't due to my thoughts and emotions. But then again, I won't know, would I? Sigh, pyscyhology is complicated.
Right, so anyway, here's some info that you may not know. When people write a non-fiction book, they'll have their general idea and at least a few sources. So, a better move might have been to look for the sources first (research and collect data) and then to start writing.
I love it how people contradict their posts in this forum. I'm sure, somewhere along the line, I've done it myself. I mean, think about it. If someone says this :-
Before this thread gets closed, allow me to have my say...
nick khaw... your comments does not warrant a reply. Constructive criticism? You've got a long way to go.
Isn't he/she already giving me a reply? Ahahahaha. Some constructive criticism here, if I really do not warrant a reply, just don't mention me at all. It makes more sense.
And well, MaxForce, I think you should read the thread again. Or read what the kid said in forums. We don't have a problem with the issues he raised. In fact, I think many of us agree that our system is flawed bla bla bla. We're not in denial. And we're not embarassed. What we're criticizing here is his decision to post about this in forums where no one understands and cares not of what is going on here. Raising these issues to Americans looking for college application help isn't going to bring much change. Another thing we're criticizing is his decision to leave the system so easily, when he is clearly intelligent enough to succeed in it. He couldn't adapt to it, so he left it. And then he blatantly criticized the system for his failure to adapt to it without a single finger pointed to himself. And yes, that summarizes what we have a problem with.
Well, if he's going to bring change, I hope he brings a positive one. Due change is needed but I hope he manages to bring a positive one. |
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nick_khaw
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Posts: 107
Location: Cambridge, Massachusetts
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Er, yeah, MaxForce, read ayjk's post. It's a better summary of why we're criticizing his actions. I think that you may have misunderstood what we were all displeased about. |
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bush
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Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 1361
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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Yes...that's it, If you can't change the system, learn to manipulate it.
ayjk.....you from HELP? |
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Maxforce
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Joined: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 241
Location: Klang, Selangor
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Isn't he/she already giving me a reply? Ahahahaha. Some constructive criticism here, if I really do not warrant a reply, just don't mention me at all. It makes more sense. |
Childish...
| nick_khaw wrote: | And well, MaxForce, I think you should read the thread again. Or read what the kid said in forums. We don't have a problem with the issues he raised. In fact, I think many of us agree that our system is flawed bla bla bla. We're not in denial. And we're not embarassed. What we're criticizing here is his decision to post about this in forums where no one understands and cares not of what is going on here. Raising these issues to Americans looking for college application help isn't going to bring much change. Another thing we're criticizing is his decision to leave the system so easily, when he is clearly intelligent enough to succeed in it. He couldn't adapt to it, so he left it. And then he blatantly criticized the system for his failure to adapt to it without a single finger pointed to himself. And yes, that summarizes what we have a problem with.
Well, if he's going to bring change, I hope he brings a positive one. Due change is needed but I hope he manages to bring a positive one. |
Well he did get a lot of attention from Msians by posting in an American forum didnt he?
| Quote: | I survived the Malaysian education system, as did many of my schoolmates. I'm doing A-Levels now, run directly from England (which is one of the 'shining paragons' of education in this day). I am still doing well, it's because I learnt to work with the system that exists. John is not wrong in saying that our Malaysian system has its flaws, but if I can suceed in the British system, surely it's not too bad, is it? Many of my friends from Malaysian government-run schools have also done well in the American system, securing places in top-notch universities in the USA.
If you can't beat the system, learn to manipulate it! |
| Quote: | | Er, yeah, MaxForce, read ayjk's post. It's a better summary of why we're criticizing his actions. I think that you may have misunderstood what we were all displeased about. |
Look, the enemy of the best is often the good - Steven R Covey. Maybe some of us think our system here is good enough. I ll say it can be better. Much better. To the extent that a total reform is needed. |
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nick_khaw
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Posts: 107
Location: Cambridge, Massachusetts
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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ayjk is not from HELP.
Childish? And you were the one talking about constructive criticism too! Ahahahhahaah. Seriously, your posts (note: your posts, not you) are quite contradictory. Ahahaha.
Attention from 3 Malaysians. Maybe 4. Among which, one brought the topic to a Malaysian forum, which was the most logical thing to do in the first place.
Oh, you'll find that many will agree with you when you say that it can be better. We all know it's flawed. Seriously, we do. We know it can be so much better than the state it is at now. Total reform? I agree. Based on ayjk's post, see why I said you misunderstood? We all know it's flawed. And we all know it can be better. We're not defending the system at all. |
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Maxforce
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Joined: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 241
Location: Klang, Selangor
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Maybe you thought I was only posting for you. I assure you that you are most mistaken. Sure, some admitted. Some however did not. Also, despite some who admitted felt that it should be keep undisclosed, so to as to "save face". What about candor? What about admission again? Why bother with embarassment when we should be proud, yeah, be proud for transparency. |
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Maxforce
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Joined: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 241
Location: Klang, Selangor
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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| nick_khaw wrote: | Attention from 3 Malaysians. Maybe 4. Among which, one brought the topic to a Malaysian forum, which was the most logical thing to do in the first place.
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Oh yeah, is that a fact or just an assumption? Why 3 or 4? Is that 3 or is that 4? Or you just assumed? |
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oneforthelord
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Joined: Nov 07, 2005
Posts: 97
Location: Singapore
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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| bush wrote: |
Secondly, I remember that the science subjects which i took for SPM doesn't go by that 'one question,one answer' scheme. It's pretty much open-ended when it comes to the essay. |
What year was that? Basically, the format of the essay question is as long as you have the required points in, you get the marks. Put in something that is correct but is not in the marking scheme and you don't get the marks, so it's not really that open-ended.
| nick_khaw wrote: | | Right, so anyway, here's some info that you may not know. When people write a non-fiction book, they'll have their general idea and at least a few sources. So, a better move might have been to look for the sources first (research and collect data) and then to start writing. |
I'm familiar with the process of writing with sources. Not every one has that style though, and John hasn't learnt how to start with sources. Sometimes I write my essays before I have sources, whacking out main points based on something I've thought of and then go looking for sources and references to see if my points are arguable. Other times I have no ideas or points and so I go and do a literature review before I start writing. I find that it's easier to write and then look for sources because you already have a idea. Sometimes, you end up dragging out an idea you don't really like from your sources.
The human psyche is very complicated, but one still has a measure of checks and balances for one's behaviour. As long as one is aware that one's thoughts and behaviour may be prejudiced or influenced, one will be more careful to allow that influence to manifest an action or opinion. You rule your thoughts; your thoughts don't rule you.
Sounds weird huh? It's a fact though that you can choose to think negative thoughts or think positive thoughts. With enough effort and practice, one can make a habit of thinking positive thoughts. that is what is meant by ruling your thoughts  On the other hand, someone who allows his thoughts to influence his behaviour without evaluating them is ruled by his thoughts. There are thoughts, and then there are thoughts (If you aren't confused by now, bravo!  ). Man can choose which he allows to influence him. |
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Maxforce
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Joined: Oct 29, 2005
Posts: 241
Location: Klang, Selangor
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Sounds weird huh? It's a fact though that you can choose to think negative thoughts or think positive thoughts. With enough effort and practice, one can make a habit of thinking positive thoughts. that is what is meant by ruling your thoughts On the other hand, someone who allows his thoughts to influence his behaviour without evaluating them is ruled by his thoughts. There are thoughts, and then there are thoughts (If you aren't confused by now, bravo! ). Man can choose which he allows to influence him. |
Well said. One must always learn to control his or her own emotions and able to call for it at will. Thus the mastery of emotions will enable to to reach new heights. |
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oneforthelord
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Maxforce wrote: |
Well said. One must always learn to control his or her own emotions and able to call for it at will. Thus the mastery of emotions will enable to to reach new heights. |
Emotions are to be controlled, yes. I was talking about a persons thoughts though, which aren't exactly the same. Emotions are felt, thoughts aren't felt at all and require more awareness and effort to catch and keep in check most of the time as they are less obvious. To many people, those thoughts seem to be just their natural thoughts and so they end up being controlled by their thoughts. |
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bush
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Joined: Feb 19, 2005
Posts: 1361
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| oneforthelord wrote: | | bush wrote: |
Secondly, I remember that the science subjects which i took for SPM doesn't go by that 'one question,one answer' scheme. It's pretty much open-ended when it comes to the essay. |
What year was that? Basically, the format of the essay question is as long as you have the required points in, you get the marks. Put in something that is correct but is not in the marking scheme and you don't get the marks, so it's not really that open-ended.
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You can't actually say that for sure, since you may not have been an examiner.....marks might be given even though it is not in the marking scheme.....that is what chief examniners are for.
Nick Khaw's year.......the essay was fairly simple..i recall.....choose one from two questions,the physics of an incubator and the physics of a space shuttle.
It is assesses our ability to apply what we have learned to an unfamiliar situation. |
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digimushu
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Joined: Mar 21, 2004
Posts: 1211
Location: Blacksburg , US
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Truly, he must be amused reading the posts... |
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